This is a weird one for you. When I work out hard, I often smell ammonia. It has to be something coming from me, because nobody else smells it. Sometimes, it is very strong. I asked my doctor about it, and she just gave me a blank stare. I believe she gave me a blood test that supposedly checked my kidney function, and everything was normal. Have you ever heard of this? If so, what is going on?

Thanks for any insight,
Susan

[This message was edited by Advice Staff on 07-11-03 at 11:46 AM.]

Just Kidding This has happened to me also, especially during a tough workout when I'm sweating alot. Are you on a low carb diet?

Basically what it is, is that you are excreting urea in your sweat. Scientifically this is what happens:In reasonabley well-nourished individuals at rest, the breakdown of protein contributes between 2-5% of the body's total energy requirement. This is called CATABOLISM this is where protein must first be degraded into it's amino acid components. Nitrogen is then stripped from the amino acid molecule in the process of deamination in the liver and excreted from the body as urea. Excretion of urea can happen through sweat especially if you are on a restricted or low carb diet.At rest you sweat about 10 mg. hr-1 of urea in exercise on a low carb diet it is around 1480 mg. hr-1. So this is why you smell ammonia, Lay that one on your Doc the next time you see him/her, I'm disappointed that they wouldn't have already known the answer

Keep Pushin' Play
Much Love and Ass kickin'
Xena- P90's Warrior Princess

what's your diet like?

keep drinking lots of water also.

anna

I am not on a particularly low carb diet or high protein diet. Lean proteins and lots of fruits and veggies. I have been researching this on the internet a bit, and have gotten conflicting info. Seems it is more common then I thought!

Some of the things I have read say that it is caused by too much protein in the diet. Some say that it is caused because the exercise is so intense that muscle breaks down faster then fat and I should eat protein directly after exercise when this happens. I have a good thirty pounds of fat to break down, so I would like to see that go first!

By the way, this isn't something I experienced for the first time with P90. It is pretty common for me when doing any tough exercise.

Thanks for your posts!

Armed with the knowledge from Xena and the internet, I want to boil this down to a few specific questions.

1. Am I breaking down excess protein from my diet, or my hard-earned muscle tissue?

2. Am I eating too much protein, not enough, or is this irrelevant? Should I be eating it, or anything else at a specific time?

3. If I am breaking down muscle, because it was faster access then fat (as stated by a couple of articles), should I ease up on my workouts to avoid this?

4. Or should I assume that it is a normal byproduct of exercise and just drink a bunch of water to flush it out of my system?

On a side note, one doctor on the internet said that this was caused by the same virus that caused some ulcers, and could be treated and wiped out in a week. He was a lone voice, though.

I wanted to bump this back up to see if I get any answers!

This whole subject has been the topic of controversy for such a long time. The first school of thought (also the oldest) states that too much protein will cause problems with your liver, blah, blah, blah. These studies were done using sedentary individuals as test subject. They don't take into account anyone that does any type of weight training or has an above sedentary lifestyle.

As you probably already know; the body uses carbohydrates as it main source of fuel, once they are depleted it will tap into your fat stores before it would start to Catabolize itself by using your hard earned muscle. This is the basis for the Second School of thought which programs like the Atkins diet and The Zone have dealt with. Using protein and fats as your sources of energy because of the fact that they both sustain long term energy and keep your insulin levels on a constant even keel. The new studies have shown that spikes in insulin levels that occur (when you eat things such as simple carbohydrates) contribute to fat stores. so, when you are depleting carbs and using protein as your main source of energy your body will more readily use the fat stores as energy.

As a competitive body builder for many years, in order to get ready for a show (where having the least amount of bodyfat was the goal) the second way of eating was my lifestyle for 12-16 weeks. Getting rid of the most amount of bodyfat while keeping most of your hard earned muscle was (is)done by increasing protein and decreasing carbs (and fats). This method has worked for years and I don't know many athletes that would disagree.

I think it's important to include complex carbs in your diet, because you need them for normal brain function-period. But increasing your protein is a helpful way of stripping some of your unwanted weight. It's also important to drink lots of water for so many reasons!

Bottom line: I don't believe that smelling the amonia smell means your body is being damaged. I believe that what you are doing is perfectly fine. But then again I'm NOT a doctor and I don't know everything. If you are really concerned, you can get at the drug store KETOSIS strips, they are with the diabetic supplies. When you dip these in your urine you can see if your body is in a state of KETOSIS. This is when your body has a build up of extracellular fluids (fats)from low carbohydrate levels.It cannot metabolize them which leads to KETOSIS.

Hope this helps, maybe even a little.
Xena

You are so knowledgeable. Thanks for the info. I just didn't like the idea of my body eating up the muscles I work so hard for. Thanks for putting my mind at ease.
Susan

Very good thread. Don't know how I missed it for so long.

Xena covered this pretty well, though ammonia is a toxin and will affect performance. An ammonia smell is often associated with ketosis but I have this occasionally and I do not eat a high-protein diet. Could be from muscle catabolization, especially if you are doing something where you are burning a lot of stored fat for fuel because some amount of muscle catabolization is almost always associated (incidently, studies show that pyruvate helps with this). If this is occuring when you exercise on an empty stomach, it would be my guess as the scenario--which would be something that you probably don't have to worry much about, but taking pyruvate might help.

It could also be caused by eating too much protein before you workout. More than around 20 grams anytime close to workout can fill the blood with too many amino acids. Excess amino acids are converted to water, carbon dioxide, and ammmonia. Ammonia is toxic to the body and will cause premature fatigue.

The protein post exercise is something that I would definitely disagree with. For optimal recovery, your glycogen stores need quick replenishment. Studies show that a 4:1 carbrotein ratio taken within one hour post exercise will maximize this. If you take creatine, this is the best time to take it also. Wait at least 30 minutes after this to consume a "normal" meal. And that could be high in protein.

[This message was edited by Fitness Advisor on 02-07-03 at 01:05 PM.]

[This message was edited by Fitness Advisor on 02-07-03 at 01:07 PM.]

Thanks. I do exercise on an empty stomach. I think my supplements have pyruvate. If not, I will have to get some!

Check your shampoo... some have ammonia in them. I know that Aveda brand does... I can't stand to use that anymore... whenever I work out and I'm starting to sweat, I can smell the ammonia.

Good luck,
MaggieJ